This could be a short post if I simply answered that question. Does your wife owe you sex? Yes. She owes you, and you owe her.
Not only is there this passage from 1 Corinthians 7:3-5:
The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. The wife does not have authority over her own body but yields it to her husband. In the same way, the husband does not have authority over his own body but yields it to his wife. Do not deprive each other except perhaps by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.
But throughout the Bible, marriage clearly includes sexual intimacy. One example is when Joseph flat-out tells his father-in-law: “Then Jacob said to Laban, ‘Give me my wife. My time is completed, and I want to make love to her'” (Genesis 29:21). Did any of you say that to your father-in-law? I would guess not.
Owing vs. Demanding
Quite a few husbands through the years have contacted me to ask why I—or other marriage authors, their pastor, the Church generally—don’t tell wives directly that they owe their husbands sex and need to pony up, so to speak.
Here’s the thing, guys:
- Lot of wives have been told this, especially by other wives. Meaning it’s said, but you may not have been in earshot.
- Feeling pressured to do something doesn’t make you want to do it more. Samuel Butler was right: “She that complies against her will is of her own opinion still” (Hudibras, 1684, gender pronoun changed).
- Pity sex isn’t satisfying to most husbands anyway.
- Wives guilted into having sex may feel resentment toward their husbands, thus damaging the whole relationship.
- Some men report that getting sex through pressure makes them feel wolfish.
In short, someone owing you something and you demanding it are not the same thing.
Imagine you have a friend in debt to you. It’s fine to ask for it or even plead a bit, but do you want an enforcer going after them? A leg-breaker? Do you think you’ll be friends for long after that?
Likewise, scriptures about the mutual duty of sex in marriage aren’t there to be used as brass knuckles in some kind intimacy shakedown. Demanding your way isn’t going to get you what you want. And it’s not biblical either.
“[Love] It does not insist on its own way” (1 Corinthians 13:5).
Scriptures about the mutual duty of sex in #marriage aren't there to be used as brass knuckles in some kind intimacy shakedown. Share on XWhat Do You Owe Her?
An additional problem of citing 1 Corinthians 7:3-5, or other passages, to convince your wife that she owes you sex is that it ignores what you owe her. The long and short of it is that God is unimpressed with us pointing out the faults of others when we don’t have our own monkey circus performing on cue.
That said, I’m not going to lecture you gentlemen. If you want to know what kind of husband you should be, you can look it up.
What I will tell you is what many wives tell me about what they’d like from their husbands. Many wives—not all, but many—believe you owe her:
- A sense of security, because it’s incredibly vulnerable to have sex. You already have your own sense of this, but it feels even more vulnerable for women because he’s likely stronger and sex involves being penetrated.
- An understanding that her sexuality is wrapped up in a whole lot of other things that aren’t you. Her past, her physiology, her schedule, her [fill in the blank]…all connect with how she feels about sex.
- You learning and respecting how her body works. Sorry, men, but it’s simply true that too many wives say their hubbies don’t listen or take time to understand their arousal and pleasure.
- A healthy emotional relationship outside the bedroom. If the rest of your marriage is struggling, she may struggle with the idea of sex too. (See point #1.)
Is That Enough?
I can already anticipate so many husbands saying: “But I do all that already! How do I get the sex I’m owed in my marriage?”
I can’t answer that definitely (though stay tuned, because we’ll have lots of ideas coming), but demanding your rights won’t get you the sex life you want. Telling your wife she owes you sex is likely to turn her off, not on.
So even if you are owed sex, even if it is a marital right, even if she’s sinning at this point by actual depriving you of the intimacy you and your marriage deserve, you’re not likely to convince her by using the Bible as a cudgel or pressuring her.
After all, the goal here is to get both of you into bed, willingly and happily, and then both of you to leave (after some reasonable amount of time) with messed-up hair, big grins, and sated hearts. Let’s not settle for dragging her to the mattress. Let’s go for Song of Songs intimacy!
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“In short, someone owing you something and you demanding it are not the same thing.
Imagine you have a friend in debt to you. It’s fine to ask for it or even plead a bit, but do you want an enforcer going after them? A leg-breaker? Do you think you’ll be friends for long after that?”
Very well put. Generally the two responses to a husband asking “does she owe me sex?” are:
1. She owes you so go beat her over the head with the Bible or…
2. She doesn’t owe you a thing so stop asking her you filthy pervert
Neither of those answers are true, neither work, and both ignore the wife’s sexuality. A much better path is what is laid out in this post. Acknowledge the truth that God designed sex to be enjoyed regularly by both spouses while also pointing out that beating someone over the head will never lead to that end goal.
What is frustrating the soul out of most men, most especially those of us who are conscientious, is that every article like this gives men a list of “obligations” that is at least 10 times longer than hers. No matter what is dictated by the “Cinderella Complex” most women are invested in, we are not, nor can we be a Disney “Prince Charming.” It will never happen, no matter how hard we try. We aren’t handsome enough, or rich enough, nor can we afford to spend all day every day putting glass slippers on her feet. Most of us have to work, and in terms of today’s feminist thought, we will always come up short. At a minimum, we will always be “toxically male,” So she will always have an “out”; An excuse not to do the ONE thing we want/need her to do, in order to motivate us to keep beating our heads against the wall day in day out in the vain hope of winning a little approval and respect.
It pains me to hear that men’s souls are frustrated, and Chris and I (J) have both discussed how certain statements and memes that circulate about men are simply unfair.
That said, we’re aiming this site at men, so our goal is to help husbands understand common themes among women. Elsewhere, we have communicated extensively to wives about how to honor their husbands, be realistic and respectful about sexuality, and pursue genuine intimacy rather than the “Cinderella Complex” you mention here. I could easily link to posts from both Chris and myself that address that issue, but again, this site and our community are for husbands.
Neither of us believes men are “toxically male,” but we also know that most wives don’t believe that either! Most wives love their husbands, but they do not feel valued themselves if/when a husband demands or pressures them for sex. And that baseline isn’t a pie-in-the-sky Prince Charming ideal, but rather a calling from Christ to love as He did. Thankfully, most husbands want to love their wives that way, but just sometimes don’t understand how their words or actions come across.
We’ll keep in mind men’s spirits as we write. Thanks for following!
Question: have either you or Chris explicitly addressed the toxic masculinity teaching? Ihave read posts by many bloggers, including you and Chris, in which wives are informed that hinting is not communicating. I get that, on this blog, you are writing to husbands and you needn’t preach to the choir.
Have you communicated/Are you communicating about the corrosive influence of saying that masculinity is toxic? After all, I think that it is quite possible that the problems that you and Chris address on your other blogs might stem from “toxic” teaching.
It’s Chris weighing in here. I don’t think either one of us has addressed the message of toxic masculinity specifically. However, we have both written quite a lot of posts that counter that message. We write about a husband’s sexual desire for his wife as a good thing, and we have both written about most Christian husbands being good-willed men.
I figure that the people who would most need to have toxic masculinity teaching challenged probably wouldn’t be reading my blog in the first place. And if I specifically wrote about toxic masculinity, it might push away the very women who need to have their thinking challenged. I try to change minds with stealth strategies.
I was just reading a piece on one of your sister sites. One frustrated, HD wife made the comment, “My body can handle months without sex, but my heart can’t.” I suppose that sentiment applies equally to all the HD spouses of both sexes. I suppose the deepest frustration, though, for the male LDs is the universal admonition that they need to just “man up, figure it out, and get the job done.” While LD women get coddled, and sympathized with, and told not to feel guilty.” I don’t think you can argue that there isn’t a massive double standard.
Yes, I can argue with that. Because while I grant that there has been an imbalance with many suggesting that sex is nowhere near as important as communication or romance or spiritual connection or whatever, Chris and I are not among those!
Rather, we have consistently reached out to women through our sites, our podcast, social media, and groups we’ve been involved in to explain to wives the importance of sex in marriage, how to correct myths and misunderstandings, and how to address obstacles to physical intimacy. We have not “coddled” LD women—though admittedly we don’t guilt them, because guilt-induced sex is not sustainable, good for the marriage, or even satisfying to most husbands (see Shaunti Feldhahn’s research on this point in For Women Only).
But this site isn’t directed at LD women, or even women. We’re very clear that our mission here is to share what we know about women’s sexuality so that husbands can use that knowledge to foster better sexual intimacy in marriage. ~J
You have a list above that brings out the nature of marriage: “… sex is nowhere near as important as communication or romance or spiritual connection or whatever…” I know you don’t believe that – you just used it as part of your discussion. My point is that most marriage counseling concentrates on those peripheral matters than the central issue.
What’s the ONE thing you get with a wedding ceremony? The right to have sex without it being a sin. Everything else, you can do with each other as friends without it being a sin.
I believe people should be made to understand that. To think you are getting married for companionship, etc, and your spouse will be OK with that is pure stupidity. The Bible makes it clear, why don’t marriage counselors and marriage blogs?
I agree completely that sex is a perk of marriage and should be emphasized more. (Obviously, since that’s the core of our ministries.) But there are other things my husband and I share because we’re married that we wouldn’t otherwise. We have a commitment to care for one another that reaches the level of covenant; we have merged our lives in the whole sense of “one flesh”; we have raised a family with an intact marriage, thus sending a message to our own kids about the importance of this undertaking; and we can present ourselves to the world as husband and wife, which gives our relationship greater legitimacy and a sense of permanence.
Ideally, Christians wouldn’t neglect any of the intimacy that can be found in marriage—from emotional, to sexual, and beyond. And yes, unfortunately, too many have focused on certain real or perceived benefits of marriage without including sex as an area that deserves attention and intention! God does not shy away from that, nor should we.
~ J
Wow……that is well put..
“every article like this gives men a list of “obligations” that is at least 10 times longer than hers.”
And, if you’re dumb enough to jump through all of her hoops, she’ll accuse you of just being nice to get sex. There is no winning with a wicked woman. And there lies the problem, women are wicked and no religious leader has the stomach to say it.
Men can take some consolation in knowing that their wives will go to hell for their sins against their marriage.
From J:
I suspect there’s a lot of hurt underlying all that bitterness you obviously feel. But let me clarify a few things:
1. Chris and I call wives out plenty about what they should do in the sexual realm in other resources directed at women. But what good would it do to have a list of what the wife should do on a site for husbands when you can’t make your spouse do anything? (And if you do force them, you’re an abusive spouse which is a whole other problem.) Our focus on this site is helping husbands understand the complexity of women’s sexuality so that they can better interact with their wives.
2. You say, “And there lies the problem, women are wicked and no religious leader has the stomach to say it.” Clearly, you’re not a woman, because you bet we’ve heard this. I’ve had 1 Timothy 2:14 thrown in my face more times than I care to count, not to mention that women are often blamed for men’s lust, infidelity, and anger. Mind you, I think husbands get blamed for a lot of stuff that isn’t their fault either. But to act like no religious leader has ever said women have a sin problem is preposterous.
3. Fine, let’s say that women can be wicked. So can men. If you really want to seek God’s truth, read Romans 3:10-12: “As it is written: ‘There is no one righteous, not even one; there is no one who understands; there is no one who seeks God. All have turned away, they have together become worthless; there is no one who does good, not even one.'” Paul’s conclusion? “Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we boast in the hope of the glory of God” (5:1-2). If your God cannot redeem women, then I suggest you’re not following the God of the Bible.
4. As for “Men can take some consolation in knowing that their wives will go to hell…” perhaps you should re-read Scripture which says: “Husbands, love your wives, and do not be harsh with them” (Colossians 3:21). Hey, even if women are the enemy, “‘But to you who are listening I say: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you….Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful'” (Luke 6:27-28, 36).
One last point: If this is where you are in your feelings about women, you are giving off that vibe, whether you know it or not. And any self-respecting woman wouldn’t be attracted to that. Don’t take my (a woman’s) word for it; read I Wouldn’t Sleep With You Either by Kevin A. Thompson.
The movie “On Chesil Beach” provides an excellent case in point, albeit a sad one. At one point the newlywed husband accuses his wife of being frigid and deceiving him—due to HIS premature ejaculation when attempting to consummate their marriage. If ever there was a movie to illustrate the need for KHS this is! That said, I am convinced there is no such thing as “frigidity.” Any woman can be brought to a point where she craves to be ravished by her lover, it only takes figuring out her unique charm combination. This is a challenge husbands have been intentionally given by God and as husbands we should revel in it. We should avail ourselves of the insight being offered by this ministry.
Female sexual response involves so many factors that it’s hard to really say that frigidity is actually a thing.
I hate to sound like a soy-sipping millennial, but that’s a really bad take.
Very hard to figure out when I get about zero feedback. Does that feel good? No response. What would you like? No response( I,m thinking she’s thinking ‘just get this over with’) very frustrating when it is a one-way street. Duty sex all the way, when it happens, which is very infrequent (3-4 times a year) after numerous requests, after I have done everything to prepare for it to be a wonderful shared experience. She just does not care.
I’m sorry you’re experiencing this. You are missing out on intimacy and connection with your wife, and that hurts. Is your wife willing to give you feedback about your relationship outside the bedroom? Would both of you agree that your relationship is fulfilling other than in the area of sex?
Here’s why I ask: If a woman doesn’t want to be having sex in the first place, she won’t want anything to feel good or wonderful, and she will want it to be over with quickly. If her body does respond or experience any pleasure, rather than enjoy it, she is likely to feel betrayed by her own body and negative about the overall experience. It is wonderful that you have worked hard to prepare for it to be a mutually enjoyable experience–but if she doesn’t want to be having sex in the first place, sex isn’t the most effective place for you to be making an effort.
What do you understand about why your wife doesn’t want to have sex in the first place? It could be that she doesn’t care, which doesn’t necessarily mean that she doesn’t care about you, just that she doesn’t understand why sex is a big deal. Or perhaps she has had negative sexual experiences in the past. Stepping outisde your own frustration and hurt, what are you able to determine about why your wife doesn’t want to have sex?
I am new to this site and am unsure about what you will have to say. There is a lot of bad advice out there and much of it claims to be biblical.
I like what I have read so far, even though some of it is challenging.
I have empathy for Bill J., yet at the same time, I want to affirm that he doesn’t speak for this man.
Even in Christian marriage, a covenant between wife and husband before God, being married is still a “civil state,” in which property, childrearing, and other matters are subject to the laws of man. It’s worthwhile for any couple to have a serious discussion before taking the step of getting married about what their expectations and understanding are for the basic spoken vow, “to have and to hold.” That is the promise that there will be sex between them. Not only does a couple need to have a common understanding about what they mean by this in order for marriage to work, but they need to check-in regularly with each other about how it’s working.
The promise of sex implies no particular frequency, positions, experimentation, or number of orgasms. It is merely a promise that there will be SOME sex. The details are for the couple to work out together, and work it out they must if they want to keep doing it and finding pleasure and intimacy in it. The obligation part of it, what each owes, is satisfied the first time they have sex within the marriage. I’d say the main practical reason we can’t demand payment is that the debt has been paid, usually years earlier. The original promise has been long since satisfied. The key to a mutually satisfying sexual union for the long term is the regular check-in with each other, and the re-affirmation and re-dedication each professes.
Yes, buried in a drawer, wedding album, or folder somewhere are the words we spoke on our wedding day. What if once a week, month, or year, we got out those written vows we spoke, and as a couple talked about our “having and holding”, our “loving, honoring, and cherishing”, and our “forsaking all others”? There is great benefit in talking regularly, setting aside a specific time for it, to talk about what’s working and what we might do differently to make it even better, including or especially sex.
Interesting perspective, Carlo. Particularly this part: “The obligation part of it, what each owes, is satisfied the first time they have sex within the marriage. I’d say the main practical reason we can’t demand payment is that the debt has been paid, usually years earlier. The original promise has been long since satisfied.”
I take the point, but I also sense that we would not have that same attitude about anything else in marriage. That is, if my husband had a job when we got married and a few years stopped working and laid around the house instead, we wouldn’t say, “He promised to provide, and he fulfilled that promise at the beginning.” If a wife cared for her husband the first time he got sick, but then abandoned him the next and subsequent times, we wouldn’t say, “Well, she did do that ‘in sickness and health’ thing at the beginning, so it’s fine.” Yes, we might be in this marriage for the long haul despite failures to meet one another’s expectations or needs, but at some point, the relationship becomes far less like a marriage and more like an obligation itself. And that isn’t how God ever intended marriage to work. By His design, marriage should be supportive and intimate—in many ways, including physical.
~J
If a wife reaches age 60 and she and her husband have raised children to adulthood and she has long since passed through menopause and decides she just doesn’t want to have intercourse again, she violates no vow and does her husband no dishonor. It’s her body. Her promise to have and to hold was open-ended, but they know that most couples reduce the intensity, duration, variety, and frequency of their sexual activities as they get older. She promised they would part not before death, not that she would open her legs for him until the day of her death. Maybe she’ll change her mind and invite that intimacy again, and maybe she won’t. He said “for better, for worse” and maybe a kiss on the lips is all she’s moved to share going forward. She doesn’t owe him intercourse 3 times per week for the next 25 years. The issue you addrssed was a “demand” and it would be unreasonable of him to demand it, for exactly the reason I gave, unless she promised otherwise.
Similarly, if a husband reaches age 60 and decides that after working for 40 years and saving some money, he’s not going to work anymore, he violates no vow and does his wife no dishonor. It’s his body. His promise to provide was open-ended but they both knew he would stop working someday. Parting was promised to occur not before death, not that he would work until he died. Maybe he’ll go back to work, and maybe he won’t. She said “for better, for worse” and maybe living on what they’ve saved over the years is all he’s moved to share going forward. He doesn’t owe her another 25 years of hard labor in employment. She can’t demand that he go ask for his old job back, because it would be an unreasonable demand, unless he’d promised otherwise.
I still don’t believe those are the same things. That is, if you worked for 40 years and then retired, you likely put some money away to live on so your work is still having benefits. You couldn’t simply quit and decide, “Oh well, we’ll lose our house and won’t be able to eat, but I’m done working!”
Having sex for many years might yield benefits that continue beyond, but stopping might cause a rift in your relational intimacy and have one or both of you feeling the loss.
(Oh, and by the way, my husband IS 60. Believe me, that’s too young for sex to die. Try 80.)
~ J